The following is the minimally edited transcript of an interview conducted in October/November 2025. A short commentary article based on this interview was previously published on this website and in Issue 17 of The Socialist.
Welcome, Alma. First off, could you introduce yourself and tell us a bit about ALRANZ and the work you do?
Thank you!
Kia ora, My name is Alma de Anda and I am co-president of ALRANZ (Abortion Law Reform Association New Zealand), along with Ella Shepherd. Since 1973, ALRANZ had advocated for the decriminalisation of abortion. In 2020 this was achieved, through a lot of work. Terry Ballamak was at the helm then, so we owe thanks to her, along with Margaret – Dame Margaret Sparrow – and all past presidents really.
Moving forward, we see ALRANZ acting as a watchdog. Because, yes, abortion has been decriminalised, but there are still a lot of access issues. Especially with governments that are anti-abortion – anti-choice – like the current government. We have to make sure that politicians [in New Zealand] don’t act like those in other countries where they slowly chip away at access, because that is a very real possibility. Yes, even here. People think it can’t happen, but it sure can. So we act as a watchdog, and we advocate for increased access.
When you say that the current government is anti-abortion, can you expand on that a little bit? Prime minister [Christopher Luxon] has given himself the title of “pro-life”, and so has Simeon Brown, the current health minister.
Luxon, in his own words, has said that, being pro-life, he thinks abortion is akin to murder. Which is ridiculous, but he was brought up in a church that advocates that. Simeon Brown has been a long time anti-abortion activist (plus he has no health experience, so he’s highly unqualified to be health minister). It’s really concerning that his views are so strong against abortion. If he continues this role, those views could come through in policies that he supports, and in what he chooses to cut funding for.
So, this government is very anti-abortion. New Zealand First is also known to be anti-abortion: people on top of the NZ First board, such as Winston Peters and Helma Vermeulen, are staunchly anti-choice. It is always really dangerous to have people with such strong beliefs about abortion in power, so we’re very much keeping tabs on this government.
What exactly are crisis pregnancy centres, and how did they come to your attention?
Crisis pregnancy centres (CPCs) are, on their face, charities that aim to help pregnant women and their families. They are giving them, maybe, some nappies and baby stuff. On the face of it, that’s great. But when you actually check out their websites and look at their views, they are anti-abortion. They are usually religion-based, either Fundamentalist Christian or Catholic.
The reality is that these are anti-abortion centres that present as unbiased sources of information and help, when they are in fact very much the opposite [of being unbiased]. They use lies and coercion tactics to basically convince people not to have an abortion.
They have been on our radar for quite some time. We see this sort of model in America and Britain as well. They are all quite connected, they are usually funded by international groups – even the Catholic Church. They have a lot of money, and they’re not taxed on anything. So we have known about them for some time; it’s the public that really does not know that these places are anti-abortion centres.
These crisis pregnancy centres are all friends. They are all, sort of, the same people. One of their tactics is to have lots of different organisations to make themselves look like they are in the majority. What we’re seeing right now is a mimicking of USA tactics.
There is a CPC in Auckland called Gianna’s Choice. It receives funding from Family Life International in New Zealand, which receives (likely a large amount) of funding from Heartbeat International, which is a global Christian anti-abortion organisation that funds crisis pregnancy centres.
Others are more insidious. Pregnancy Choice CPCs operate like op shops. They are run as charities, because in the back there is a section where they give away baby stuff for koha. Inside the shop, they offer free pregnancy tests. There are signs everywhere saying “ask at the counter.” We know that this organisation is anti-abortion, but we don’t know what they are saying to people who tell them they are pregnant.
In some cases CPCs are run by General Practitioner doctors (GPs) and midwives, so they seem more “legit”. This has happened in Nelson and in Wellington with Crisis Pregnancy Support Hapai Taumaha Hapūtanga.
What dangers do crisis pregnancy centres pose for pregnant people and those seeking abortions?
First, they spread disinformation around abortion. Anti-abortion groups are really the original disinformation groups. They lie about abortion and the side effects. They are citing a very flawed 2008 article from the University of Otago about how abortion supposedly increases drug use and depression.
So the danger for someone, not knowing these places are anti-abortion, is first the disinformation and second the shame. They are told things like “you’re already a mum” and “don’t kill your baby.”
Gianna’s Choice, for example, has two ultrasound machines (which I think most GPs would be jealous of). We think they also have an ultrasound in their mobile unit. The problem is, you’re not guaranteed that a trained sonographer will give you that scan. They say in their own newsletters that a midwife is running training sessions. Midwives can do scans, however, they are not licensed to train others to do these – [providing such training] is not within their scope.
The risk is not only that you have someone unqualified giving you the scan, it is that they might lie to you and say that you are further along than you are – shaming you by saying “it’s a baby” making you listen to the “heartbeat” (which is not really a heartbeat).
They target people in low socioeconomic areas. At Gianna’s Choice, they offer “abortion reversal” if you have already started the abortion process (more on that in a moment). If not, they say “we have a lot of wealthy donors and we will help you with the costs… we will support you.” We have no idea if they follow through with that. We don’t know what people are being asked to do in return for this support. It’s quite coercive, because who knows if they’re going to follow through and for how long – are they going to pay their bills?
Some organisations are pushing something called “abortion reversal.” This started in San Diego, California, where this GP started experimenting on women. For medical abortion, you take two doses of mifepristone (which stops the development of the pregnancy by blocking progesterone), 24 hours apart. Their reasoning was that, if they just give a high dose of progesterone after that initial dose of mifepristone, then they could possibly reverse the abortion. This doctor in San Diego was telling women to use this treatment “if you take the first dose and you regret it.” These experiments are unethical and dangerous. A 2019 study of these “abortion reversal” techniques had to be stopped because participants experienced hemorrhaging.
Gianna’s Choice, and another organisation that we know of called Pro Love, are claiming that they know a GP who will prescribe this progesterone. There is no standard for progesterone [administration]. Because there are no studies and this is not evidence based, they are taking a wild guess and putting people in danger.
In the USA, the Academy of Gynecologists and Obstetrics have come out against people claiming to provide abortion reversal. Here in New Zealand, ALRANZ has made the Ministry of Health aware of these CPCs, and they came out with a statement last year saying “the Ministry of Health does not support or recognise the practice of ‘abortion reversal’ and is concerned about reports that this may be offered in New Zealand”, and that “those who promote the use of medicines for this purpose are breaching section 20 (2) of the Medicines Act 1981,” because we did identify a doctor who was saying they would provide this, and we wanted the Ministry to let them know that they can’t be doing this.
What does the broader anti-abortion movement in New Zealand look like at this time?
They are emboldened because of the fall of Roe v. Wade in the USA, and this far Right leaning fascism that is spreading worldwide. That’s why we’re seeing them saying in their newsletters that they are going to “build a network of doctors” in secret to prescribe “abortion reversal,” and performing ultrasounds on people that they’re not qualified to do.
There is Family First New Zealand (FFNZ), the deregistered charity that Bob McCoskrie heads. Simon O’Connor, former National MP for Tāmaki, is now also with FFNZ. They are all friends, and they all have podcasts, or they put themselves on video. They present themselves as professionals, but they’re just men with opinions. They are all connected to anti-abortion groups like Voice for Life and Right to Life. There are some GPs, unfortunately, who are helping them.
The CPCs, and the wider anti-abortion movement, are really going after youth. This man, Brendan Malone, seems to be the big speaker around this programme called Acitv8. They fund training events for youth. They are well funded, there is very nice food – it’s not, like, a couple of bickies. And it’s very emotional. It’s all lies. They train them how to counter pro-choice narratives. They are targeting very young people, high school age.
These groups bring in speakers from overseas – Canada, the US – to train New Zealand groups on how to talk about abortion. Just last year they brought a speaker from Canada, from an organisation called the “Canadian Centre for Bioethical Reform” (which is a bunch of BS, they’re just anti-abortion). They are here now: there is a Centre for Bioethical Reform New Zealand group on Facebook. Their strategy is to go door-knocking talking about abortion. They are the ones with those big graphic photos of alleged abortions, which are all doctored, or pictures of people’s stillborns or miscarriages. They have little groups around the country; a handful of people go out and stand on a busy highway exit, or wherever there is foot traffic, and try to engage people in conversations with those big graphic banners.
The anti-abortion movement is small but well-funded. They have lots of money for travel, signs, and advertising. They are set up as charities, and they are doing charitable things, so it is hard for us to do anything about it unless we can prove that they’ve harmed or deceived someone.
They are also connected politically: New Zealand First is very friendly with Family First New Zealand; Winston Peters was on Bob McCoskrie’s podcast talking about trans people. They have found a really good wedge with trans people. They’ve managed to scare a lot of people about trans people, saying “oh, the schools are pushing this on your kids.” It is all the same aim: if they can limit trans health care, puberty blockers, and surgeries, then they can chip away at abortion later on. It’s all connected.
What is being done, and what can be done, to counter CPCs?
The problem with these charities is that no one seems to know what to do with them. We’ve told the Ministry of Health, we’ve told the Charities Register, and we’ve never had a response back. We let the Medical Council know about that doctor [who was claiming to provide abortion reversal], and they just said “yeah, we talked to him and he won’t do it again.” It is very tricky to figure out how to hold them accountable with the current laws and policies that there are.
ALRANZ has taken it upon ourselves to make a concerted effort on educating people about CPCs, because truly people don’t know what they are. We will be providing information and hosting webinars on our website.
The other thing is promoting access. Have you heard of the early medical abortion website, decide.org.nz?
No, I haven’t!
This is the thing, even though abortion is decriminalised, I feel like the Ministry of Health, Te Whatu Ora, Family Planning (now Sexual Wellbeing Aotearoa), don’t advertise these services. Maybe they don’t have enough money, I don’t know.
So, after law reform, this website was set up. It is funded by Te Whatu Ora and run by Sexual Wellbeing Aotearoa and a health firm called Magma Healthcare. From there, you can get abortion pills mailed to your local pharmacy. Everything is done on the phone. That has been around for four or five years now, and every time I ask someone if they know, they say “no.” There has been a big uptick in early medical abortion since law reform, but we want to be getting the information out there more to counter the anti-choice websites, which are all doom and gloom.
It sounds like there is room for grassroots action here in terms of calling out these centres and spreading information…
Yes. That’s one of my personal goals, to let the CPCs know we’re going to call them out. I would like to have stickers we can mail out to people saying “this is an anti-abortion centre” and put those up. Or do what they have done in Oregon, Texas: reproductive justice groups have been putting up posters with phone numbers, a QR code, that directs you somewhere you can report a place as a CPC.
Warm thanks to Alma de Anda for this interview, and to ALRANZ for their work.
As Alma says, it’s important to spread awareness. Please spread the word and, if you would like to help, reach out to ALRANZ, ISO, and other groups in your area to see what opportunities there are to organise against crisis pregnancy centres and other anti-choice initiatives.
Image: Placards prepared for the Pōneke Anti-Fascist Coalition counter to the 2022 anti-abortion so-called “March For Life” rally in Te Whanganui-a-Tara.
